Considering move to Lake Chapala - how do you all like it?

[CanadianLady]

Hi Everyone! I am assuming this message board contains people who have chosen to relocate or vacation in Lake Chapala.  I am planning the next chapter of life which is a move to my forever place and Lake Chapala seems to be the place.

I have tons of questions but won't bore you with them all here (unless you'd like that 😉) but if any of you would like to share you're general feelings, I'd be very thankful.  

Quick snapshot of me, born in Canada in 68. Lived many countries (USA, Canada, Indonesia, Phillipines, Africa)  for work and time to settle down. Currently reside in USA. 

[gringal]

Moved here many years ago from California.  No regrets...love it!

[Hud]

Everyone that still lives here loves it, although several are constant complainers about one thing or another. The other 50% that returned to their original country after some time, left because they hated it, or for other reasons. Whatever, they are no longer here. 50% is pretty typical for those who move to Mexico. Don't break all your ties where you will be coming from in case you are the latter 50%.

 

 

[Kiko]

@CanadianLady,  a friendly tip for new members here.  You will find that if your posts include grammatical and spelling errors, then you will receive many more replies.  DAMHIK  🤡

[Mostlylost]

The best advice is to come down for a week to a local hotel or B&B, look around and then rent a place for a month or so to see how you like it, how you find living here yourself.  Visit the Chapala society, hang out in the plaza in the town you are thinking of. Most expats here are more than happy to talk with you in person about their experiences. 

 

[ibarra]

We have lived full time in MX for 25 years, 2 different States. Won't move nob again.

[Natasha]

We Canadians also here 25 years.... all in this area. Was NOT the plan... but worked out that way.  In fact, hubbie has never once gone back in all these 25 years!!!  (If they want to see me, they know where I am.....)

Agree with MostlyLost......   each person  has different ideas of what suits or fits and what doesn't. Come and look, but also consider WHY do you think this is a fit?  For some, gated communities and LCS are what they seek. For others, Mexican neighbourhoods and exposure to people, culture, and customs are more up their alley.

Some like smaller areas  Others like being near the BIG city.  And so on and so on............

[Ferret]

On 7/23/2023 at 1:21 PM, CanadianLady said:

 Lived many countries for work and time to settle down. Currently reside in USA. 

This, to me, means that you're adventurous and adaptable. Which says a whole lot about whether you'll like it or not. I'm also a fellow Canadian who moved down in '96 and stayed. Cover your bases to make sure. We left the equivalent of furnishings for a one bedroom apartment in storage in Toronto just in case. By the time we had lived in San Miguel de Allende for three months, we knew we had made the right choice and never looked back. It is much more difficult to get residency now because it has to be applied for at the nearest Mexican Consulate in your country of residence (or is it your country of citizenship??). Anyway, lots more hoops to jump through. I would suggest a six month stay on a tourist visa to figure out if it works for you before making any further commitment. There are only 2 months of the year that I am not a fan of here and they are mid April to mid June when it's kinda hot. This year was an anomaly and added another month because the rains started very late. Many Canadians are snowbirds with a foot in both countries. Whatever works for you.

[lakeside7]

Never, whatever your thoughts are now...Never give up your NOB medical coverage...unplanned things happen and one finds themselves having to consider going back north

[NEWMtnMama]

Couple of suggestions. Rent first for at least a year. Be sure you like the town and neighborhood you are in. There are semi-rural neighborhoods like Chapala Haciendas and village neighborhoods like Las Redes in Chapala. and gated communities. Each has pluses and minuses. Ajijic tends to be more Gringolandia with Chapala and Jocotopec more 'Mexican small town'. 

Lake Chapala Society (LCS) is an excellent resource so be sure to take advantage of it.

[Ferret]

2 hours ago, lakeside7 said:

Never, whatever your thoughts are now...Never give up your NOB medical coverage...unplanned things happen and one finds themselves having to consider going back north

As a Canadian citizen who is an official non-resident of Canada and had to give up my Canadian medical coverage, I know that if, for whatever reason, I need to go back to Canada, I only need to inform the authorities and my coverage will kick in again after three months. So it's not a permanent cut off should you decide to go back. Still, with the waiting times for everything in Canada and being aware of the excellent and timely medical care here, I'll stay.

[tomgates]

All the advise above is good. We were in Ajijic, 3 blocks from the plaza, for about 15 years. Early years were half and half with the US and later full time. We had private health insurance first than after 2010 Obamacare. That served us well on our trips back to the US. Routine stuff we paid out of pocket there because it was so cheap. You are 55 so keep your insurance. 

We liked Ajijic because all our friends were nearby. Las Salvias is a good area, great views and also cooling breezes coming down from the mountains. Just above Ajijic village so close to there too. All the real estate offices handle rentals. This is a good time to come down as all the snowbirds have left. www.chapalamls.net is a good resource for sales or rentals.

[ibarra]

We left everything behind, including insurance, except for a bank account in the U.S.  Have used MX medical system for a couple of surgeries etc., no problems.  We completely cut ties and have been very happy for the last 25 years.  Of course, we don't have any family NOB and our choice won't work for everyone.

[Jreboll]

Mmm.  Born in 68, makes you about 55 yo.  Your social life might be a little different than most of us.

[Kiko]

If I was about 55 I think I would spend a few days in the Chapalita neighborhood of Zapopan.  Beautiful area and lots of things to do.  Vibrant.

[Guiness]

Hola fellow Canuck. Been here 13 years, great place but now wayyyyyyy to overpopulated and very expensive housing market. You could find a better location elsewhere in Mexico. 

[Ferret]

And elsewhere is where exactly?

[Jreboll]

I would recommend Jiquilpan, Mich.  but you would have to learn spanish

[CanadianLady]

17 hours ago, Mostlylost said:

The best advice is to come down for a week to a local hotel or B&B, look around and then rent a place for a month or so to see how you like it, how you find living here yourself.  Visit the Chapala society, hang out in the plaza in the town you are thinking of. Most expats here are more than happy to talk with you in person about their experiences. 

 

Thank you, that was what I wanted to do but was struggling to see what area I would find y'all.  When the trip is imminent, I'll post again and see if anyone would be interested in meeting (or find out a common spot y'all enjoy).  Thanks so much to you and all those that posted.  Glad to see so many lovely people living there

[Hud]

55 minutes ago, Guiness said:

Hola fellow Canuck. Been here 13 years, great place but now wayyyyyyy to overpopulated and very expensive housing market. You could find a better location elsewhere in Mexico. 

Exactly where would that be?

 

[Mainecoons]

Been here over 15 years, going north in 3 weeks to sell our RV, last connection to there other than several bank accounts.  Here for the duration.

Some things better over the years, some things not.  Overall better but we did luck into a great location.  Things were getting sorta trashy and pot holey but the Pueblo Magico seems to be making improvements at least in and around centro.  Our war on graffiti has gone well in Ajijic, adding to the appeal.

It has become a great deal more expensive to buy and rent here, IMHO not only because of the expats but also the area is very popular with the more well off from GDL.

If I were moving here today, I'd focus on Chapala and San Antonio.  Riberas still has a ton of problems mostly related to lack of services and sewers.  Buying in there is good for the long term, I expect some improvement in both categories.

Very important to self assess your tolerance for traffic and noise and focus your location search on what suits best.  Not hard to find quieter you just have to know where to look.  Renting for a while and walking the heck out of the towns that appeal to you.  Just about any life style from in-village to semi-rural available here.  The better your Spanish, the more options here and elsewhere.

I see lots of expats in places like Patzcuaro, Morelia, GDL, Cd. Mexico and Oaxaca to name a few.  Lovers of the beach who can handle the heat have a lot of choices along the coast.  If I lived at the beach it would be Manzanillo.

Hang out at the Lake Chapala Society and the American Legion.  Plenty of nice folks more than willing to talk to you.

[hkrause]

As you're aware from your travels, every place is different, with some aspect appealing and others not so great. Different strokes, and all that. Whether YOU like this location will depend on your own preferences and personality.

First rule: Don't believe anybody who tries to convince you that Lakeside is "paradise" with no down side! Listen to the negatives as well... don't ignore them because you already like the area from things you've heard. Take the good, the bad, and evaluate realistically based on your needs.

Second: Heed the suggestions to visit in person. Depending on you, a couple of short, intensive research trips might work. 6 Months that span both the hot/dry weather and the pleasant rainy season would be better. Renting for a year would be best. Like Hud and others have said, this isn't everybody's cup of tea and some end up leaving to go back "home" or elsewhere. Real estate commissions are expensive... don't plan to buy until you're more certain you'll stay for a few years, at least.

That said, we did about 5 years of thorough research before coming here, including 2 trips during the different seasons. We considered many other places to relocate and decided on Lakeside for retirement. We moved here 11 years ago and have stayed, loving some things and hating others. The things we enjoy outweigh the negatives enough that we have no immediate plans to leave, but we recognize that situations change. From my experience, the main reasons people stay awhile then leave are: 1) Didn't research enough in advance to realize certain things would be such a turn-off, 2) Health changes, making it advantageous to return to a familiar system back home, and 3) Family situation creates a change of heart - either missing family back home, or a partner separation/divorce leaves someone without their main support. 

Here are some of the positives, which we find appealing about Lakeside (keep reading for the negatives to consider)...

The people - both locals and other expats are generally pleasant, welcoming and helpful. There ARE exceptions to this on both sides, but the overall feel is very positive.

Slow pace - we seldom feel rushed to be anywhere in a hurry. Appointments and movie times are the exception. Meals are wonderfully relaxed, with the expectation that you'll take your time visiting or enjoying the scenery/weather afterward. No rushing you away from the table to seat the next customer.

Weather - we're from Kansas City originally, which is cold with ice/snow in winter and hot/humid in the summer. We tended to live indoors or in our cars to stay comfortable for months at a time. Here our house doesn't even have HVAC. It gets chilly in the evenings (great for sleeping) and sometimes hot during the day (mainly in May to mid-June), but we get by with a small space heater in winter, or fans in summer. Natural ventilation is key, with most businesses having doors/windows open all the time along with outdoor seating. Some people add a small room a/c unit for when it's hottest... after this last summer we're considering it! But generally the weather here is one of the main draws.

Medical - good care is available and much less expensive than in the US. Dental and vision care is inexpensive enough that you don't need insurance. Other medical can be paid out-of-pocket, depending on what you need done. Many hospitals are top notch quality with very modern equipment and procedures. Senior care is available, with attitudes about caring for the elderly much different than the warehouse mentality up north.

Culture - even though Lakeside is becoming more modern and caters to gringos in many ways, local culture and traditions still have a strong hold. There are frequent celebrations and events to enjoy and even participate in.

Art - this is an artist community and art is EVERYWHERE, from museums and galleries to murals on buildings and other structures to art shows. There is even a children's art program at LCS to encourage future artists and feed the soul. "Art" extends to performance as well, with many live music, dance and stage productions to enjoy. If you're artistic yourself (and even if you're not), you'll find plenty of opportunity to let your creativity flow.

Dining - we love to eat out and there are literally hundreds of options to choose from within the Lakeside area, from little taco stands and inexpensive spots to mid-range to upscale and even some high-end dining "event" opportunities. Lots of variety as well. That's just in the Lakeside area... Guadalajara multiplies that beyond imagination.

Natural beauty - the lake is huge and helps moderate the weather in addition to being scenic. Mountains ring the lake and turn a gorgeous green during rainy season, very much resembling the scenery in other volcanic areas, like Hawaii. The climate supports both tropical and dessert plants, so there is ALWAYS something blooming and color everywhere. 

Expat support - with so many expats here already, you'll find plenty of help in relocating and existing comfortably. There are major groups (LCS, American Legion, etc) with many resources, religious groups, special-interest groups, neighborhood groups, classes, and social media. In addition to this discussion board, there are many Facebook groups that are very active and at least one other discussion board. Be sure to take everything you hear or read with  grain of salt... some people love to hype the area and offer a view through rose-colored glasses, while there are some curmudgeons and trolls who make a hobby of griping and moaning. The truth is somewhere in between, flavored by your own perspective.

Guadalajara - separated by a mountain range to keep the big city from encroaching, but close enough to have available all the resources of Mexico's 2nd largest city. An international airport is about 45 minutes away (depending where you start from), major shopping malls and familiar stores/dining provide plenty of shopportunity (Costco/Sam's, Sears, Home Depot, Office Max, McDonalds/Burger King/Chili's/Carl's Jr/Popeye's/etc.), Large and modern supermarkets are available in case you enjoy shopping outside the options available Lakeside (Mega and Fresco are amazing), there are loads of museums and historic sites to see, a wonderful zoo, awesome architecture, movie theaters and major concert venues... the list barely scratches the surface!

Nearby attractions - the ocean is a reasonable drive (3-4 hours), and there are so many interesting towns and natural attractions within a day's drive from here. Multiple companies provide English-speaking tours to many places, either as day trips, or multi-night travel with tours at the destination and along the way. If you're comfortable driving, you can get to many of these sites on your own, without the tour. 

Like I said, this is just a partial list of the highlights we enjoy here. There are negatives as well, however. If somebody tries to gloss over the bad parts, they're probably trying to sell you something. Here's a few things to weigh on the other side of the scale...

The people - along with the good, there are bad. With the difference in "wealth" created by gringos and middle-class Mexicans coming here, it provides opportunity for a fair amount of property crime and scams. You have to be aware and careful. Don't flaunt money or expensive things that will draw attention from bad actors, and plan to use protection for your home and valuables to discourage burglaries. Watch out for pickpockets and those who would trick you into parting with your money for a sales pitch or promises they won't keep. Prepare yourself for the scourge of entitled expats, who feel "their way" is always better and that they are more important than others, especially locals. Some people are real butt-holes!

Medical - although there is plenty of good quality, there is also shoddy service and poor quality, even dangerous, care around. It's a buyer-beware environment and you really need to research before deciding what hospital or medical professional to use. You don't have the same protections you have up north in case something goes wrong.

Trash, litter and clutter - we're often amazed at how clean places are kept... you even see street vendors and shop keepers sweeping the sidewalk and street around their businesses. However, there's a lot of trash and litter scattered around since people think nothing about tossing things along the street or leaving trash bags where street dogs can tear into them. Businesses, although clean, can seem cluttered and run-down with wiring and pipes everywhere, structures in need of repair, paint that is sloppy, and "things" stuffed/hanging everywhere. It takes some getting used to.

Prison walls - home and business security measures can seem intimidating and make you feel like you're surrounded by prison walls... tall fences, electric fences, razor wire, glass shards embedded in concrete, thorny plants, gates on carports, cameras, big dogs, bars on doors and windows. All intended to encourage invaders to seek a softer target, but the appearance can be a bit frightening.

Language barrier - unless you speak fluent Spanish, you will feel a bit lost with so much chatter around you that's not understandable. Many businesses have someone who can speak at least some English, but there are some that don't. If you get into an emergency situation it can be scary not being able to communicate your needs. Signs are usually in Spanish and the messages might apply to you, but you're not sure. Google Translate (or your preferred translation app) is a great friend for helping with translation of words, phrases, signs, and even spoken conversation, but it's not perfect.

Unfamiliar procedures - many things are handled differently than in the US/Canada/Europe and it can be confusing knowing how to tackle even the simplest task, such a paying bills or buying certain products. This is where the support of other expats comes in handy, but you'll often run into situations that are unfamiliar or confusing. It's a learning process. Some people hire "facilitators" or helpers to get over the hump with some hand-holding. Don't be afraid to ask for assistance or guidance.

Crime and danger - yes, the cartels and other organized crime is active in this area and all around Mexico. They are well funded, equipped, and dangerous if you run across them. Lakeside is usually excluded from the US State Dept warnings about dangerous areas, but you need to be aware and careful even here. I feel safer where we live now than back in the US, but every place has its active hot spots that are to be avoided. Sign up for the State Dept STEP program to receive updates (problem areas change frequently), and keep and eye on local social media to stay aware of any potentially unsafe locations or activities. Use common sense but realize that some of the dangers here are different from what you're used to... get educated.

Politics - the politics can be confusing and worrisome, but unless you're a citizen you're not able to vote and are generally discouraged from being politically active. Causing problems can get you kicked out of the country. Although the government at Lakeside is open to input from expats and foreigners, we don't really have much say in many things that happen around us. Adjust your thinking to accept that you're a guest here and that you have limited options.

Police - local police, traffic cops, state police, military and others are everywhere. Some drive around in vehicles with mounted machine guns or openly carry weapons at the ready. They are armed and they are serious. Generally, they are present to keep things under control, but some can use their power to intimidate or scam. You'll hear stories about police asking for "mordita" (bribes) and threatening to take your vehicle or toss you in jail if you don't comply. This has never happened to us and I think it's less common than some would have you believe, but the problem DOES exist and we know people who have been robbed by these authority figures. 

Lake Dangers - you won't see the lake used much for swimming or recreation because of concerns about pollution and underwater hazards. While some lakes in the US would be a great draw for boaters, fishing, water skiing and such, this one is far less active. There are kayakers and sail boats, but most of the fishing is by locals who use the fish to help feed their families or to sell to other locals. Every year we hear of some drownings... from people falling off boats or wading into the water from shore. There are water plants that are easy to get tangled in, plus barbed wire and other structures just below the surface (constructed when the lake levels were down, then covered when water comes back up). If you want to go in the water, use a pool, head to the ocean, or find some other recreational lakes.

Utilities - service can be inconsistent, especially during rainy/stormy season, but any time of year actually. Internet has frequent outages in some areas and slow service at other times. Power can go out for hours at a time. Water service can be unreliable depending on your water source and location. Sewers are old and overburdened so it's not uncommon to trash used TP instead of flushing it, and sometimes it's tough to get the toilet to flush at all. This area is growing much faster than government is updating infrastructure to handle new construction, so there are concerns about systems not being able to handle the load.

Traffic - there's ONE main road around the lake and between villages, where most traffic flows. It can be difficult to get around on side streets because many are cobblestone with lots of bumps, holes and frequent construction. Therefore, traffic is slow and often backed up, especially on weekends and holidays when tourists flood the area. There is a nice, new bicycle path along the main road, which is getting much more use from those who want to get around more quickly, and bicycle shops provide options for transportation including eBikes. However, car/truck/motorcycle traffic continues to get worse. Patience is required, and it's always appreciated if you're considerate enough to let people turn or get onto the main road from side streets.

Noise - from cohetes (LOUD fireworks) to traffic to dogs and livestock to businesses to celebrations and church bells to street vendors and vehicles with loudspeakers... there is a LOT of sonic ambiance in the area. Different areas more than others, and different noises depending on where you live. One good reason to visit the area or live somewhere for awhile is to find out what it sounds like. There are lots of "eventos" (event centers) that seem quiet most of the time, but have parties with fireworks and loud music that last into the night. Some restaurants have live music late at night. Daytime salespeople drive around with messages repeated on loudspeakers to let residents know they are near. It's difficult to know what type and duration of noise you'll endure without being in an area for awhile since it can be intermittent. Some people enjoy the activity while others hate it. Nervous pets can be especially affected by loud sounds during storms or celebrations. Don't be one of those people who come down unprepared and then complain when you're bothered by not being able to sleep, or because your dog gets upset. We're tired of hearing the whining.

Home Entertainment - generally you can't just turn on your TV and get what you're expecting. Having usable programming is a constant challenge that requires some investigation, configuration, and getting used to. Cable options are generally in Spanish. Satellite services are unreliable as NOB companies change equipment to exclude use in Mexico. Various Internet companies can be used for streaming with a variety of services, but you have to pay something to get going and service outages are common. If you're not tech savvy, it can all be confusing and complicated. There are people who can help, but you'll have to do some digging to figure out what options are best for your area or house. Some aren't available everywhere. Enjoy the journey! Oh, and if you're used to turning on your car radio for entertainment, understand that mostly you'll get static here or something in Spanish. Music streaming services on your phone connected to car radio via Bluetooth will be more friendly.

OK, geez... that's wordy and long, so I'll leave it at that. It will give you a start for your own research and snapshot of the area from one perspective. My interests and preferences will probably be different from your own, however, which is why visiting in person can be very important. When we were researching originally, I had LOTS of input from others, but found that their priorities and perceptions were often different from what I found when we checked things out in person. You'll be the same. Be sure to check some other social media options if you haven't already to get a wider variety of opinions. Happy researching!

[Bueno]

Wow!!  An excellent review of Lakeside living--after living here almost 20 years I agree with all of the above observations.

[Ferret]

Hkrause, GREAT post. The wonderful thing about "thinking about relocating" now is the advantage of the internet. So much simpler for people to get the details such as those that you provided. We came down with one paperback called "Choose Mexico". 'Nuff said. LOL.

[RickS]

That Post needs to be pinned here!  Good non-judgmental treatise on living Lakeside.