Jess Posted February 22, 2023 Report Share Posted February 22, 2023 16 minutes ago, Sea said: The IMSS website that tells house workers their rights says the program is voluntary. Also that pension's are not included. What is your source for your information? You cited "DOF". Please provide link. https://imss.gob.mx/personas-trabajadoras-hogar The IMSS locally is not a panacea for maids. My maid wouldn't use it even if there were no obstacles or issues because there is no local medical services, even for emergencies. Happy to :https://dof.gob.mx/nota_detalle.php?codigo=5671665&fecha=16/11/2022#gsc.tab=0 Notice the IMSS site is not updated. It still quotes vacation days as 6 after year 1 and this changed Dec 27th, 2022. Imss is somuch more than medical. You should check out all the buckets they are entitled to. But most importantly, it's now. The law Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 22, 2023 Report Share Posted February 22, 2023 Well most domestic employees are certainly of the impression it’s voluntary. I’ll be guided accordingly by them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 22, 2023 Report Share Posted February 22, 2023 1 minute ago, Dostortas said: Well most domestic employees are certainly of the impression it’s voluntary. I’ll be guided accordingly by them. Lack of knowledge isn't a legal grounds for ommission. This is a workgroup that has historically been excluded and discriminated against. It's high time they're respected for their work and receive the benefits that are due to them. You've now seen the law, if you choose not to participate, that's on you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 I’m alright with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 hour ago, Jess said: Lack of knowledge isn't a legal grounds for ommission. This is a workgroup that has historically been excluded and discriminated against. It's high time they're respected for their work and receive the benefits that are due to them. You've now seen the law, if you choose not to participate, that's on you. Many women in this work class are part time employees. In my employee's case, 12 hours per week with no other employers. What kind of benefits would she expect from being enrolled in the program? Full medical benefits? Or prorated in some way? Pension if it is covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Dostortas said: I’m alright with that. Somehow I'm not surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 On 12/31/2022 at 1:57 PM, JKL said: I want to be in compliance with the new law regarding paying my maid's Social Security (IMSS) etc. But I have not seen where to obtain the form (s), or where to submit them. Can someone please give the details for obtaining the forms, and also in how to submit them, ie., e-mail, bank, etc. Your help would be greatly appreciated. IMSS has a great website with tutorials, faqs. etc. Here's a video on how to go through the process https://www.imss.gob.mx/personas-trabajadoras-hogar/como-lo-hago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 On 1/2/2023 at 4:44 PM, ibarra said: Many workers have multiple employers. If you provide IMSS for an employee that works for other people, are those NOT providing IMSS breaking the law? Hardly. If an employee doesn't want IMSS it is their choice. Vacation pay for working on holidays is a law too. But just like paying IMSS, if the employee doesn't want to be paid double or triple wages, it is their choice. Oh gosh, this is not correct. Labor Law in Mexico is totally different than the US or Canada (my apologies if my assumption of your origin is not correct). It is highly regulated and it is not at will as it is in in the countries of north of us. These are legal entitlements and the employer is legally entitled to provide them. The law is so specific that you can't write clauses or addendums to any part of the law that negates it. It's not how it works. I'm telling you this for your own good because the North mindset is a risky one when it comes to labor laws. We understandably come in with our preconceived ideas of how things work because it makes sense to us. But really, it's our responsibility to understand and comply with the laws where we choose to call home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 On 1/3/2023 at 7:34 AM, Mainecoons said: I'm not sure it is going to work that way. It appears mandatory looking at the legislation. I am assuming the agency responsible for collecting is going to publish some guidelines at some point. It seems pretty difficult to implement for people who work short hours for multiple people, but let's see what they come up with. This is exactly right. Good news is, it's not really not that hard once you understand the process. This is a good video of how to register. You have to collect the info and input into the digital platform. https://www.imss.gob.mx/personas-trabajadoras-hogar/como-lo-hago Once you watch the video, poke around their site, they also have a great phone app. There's places specifically dedicated to domestic workers and it's filled with info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natasha Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Jess said: But really, it's our responsibility to understand and comply with the laws where we choose to call home. Just curious. You've never appeared ( in THIS I.D. form) before now. So who made YOU the IMSS enrolment police??? 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 4 hours ago, Natasha said: Just curious. You've never appeared ( in THIS I.D. form) before now. So who made YOU the IMSS enrolment police??? I’m guessing the self banned Eric Blair, the bombardment of responses seems pretty similar in style. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 4 hours ago, Natasha said: Just curious. You've never appeared ( in THIS I.D. form) before now. So who made YOU the IMSS enrolment police??? This is a silly response and your comments have been rather bullyish and misogynistic. It's the law and it's really good for these women. For you to criticize anyone advocating for that is telling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 6 minutes ago, Jess said: This is a silly response and your comments have been rather bullyish and misogynistic. It's the law and it's really good for these women. For you to criticize anyone advocating for that is telling. You’re really reaching now. Careful, soap boxes can be slippery. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 minute ago, Dostortas said: You’re really reaching now. Careful, soap boxes can be slippery. 9 minutes ago, Jess said: This is a silly response and your comments have been rather bullyish and misogynistic. It's the law and it's really good for these women. For you to criticize anyone advocating for that is telling. Well then how about cultural appropriation and exploitation. Does that fit better? The mere fact that you're being combative about a law that benefits others says EVERYTHING about your view of your own importance in this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 minute ago, Jess said: Well then how about cultural appropriation and exploitation. Does that fit better? The mere fact that you're being combative about a law that benefits others says EVERYTHING about your view of your own importance in this country. Well, thank you for the comedy and the drama 😎😆 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 Just now, Dostortas said: Well, thank you for the comedy and the drama 😎😆 And thanks for your humanity. Well done you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 My own thought was that this was someone who had posted on the forum before. Unusually combative and confident for a new comer, but I stay out of the forum wars by choice (well before this post) and don't recognize styles, etc. Curious what is misogynistic about Natasha's post? And now that I'm ignoring my own very good advice about staying out of "forum wars"... please explain your understanding of cultural appropriation as it applies to this topic? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 Ummmm, no thanks - not getting waylaid off this very important topic . I'm confident because I know the facts, call that what you will. This topic is about a law. meant to overcome the discrimination and oppression this work group has suffered for a very long time. This is not the first conversation with gringos that I've had who feel above what this law is intended to do. "It's too expensive, it's inconvenient, I don't think it's right:" etc. None of these matter and we are guests in this country and it's our obligation to follow this law. Knowingly living on someone else's back when you have a choice has many words. So choose whichever one feels right to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 9 minutes ago, Jess said: Ummmm, no thanks - not getting waylaid off this very important topic . I'm confident because I know the facts, call that what you will. This topic is about a law. meant to overcome the discrimination and oppression this work group has suffered for a very long time. This is not the first conversation with gringos that I've had who feel above what this law is intended to do. "It's too expensive, it's inconvenient, I don't think it's right:" etc. None of these matter and we are guests in this country and it's our obligation to follow this law. Knowingly living on someone else's back when you have a choice has many words. So choose whichever one feels right to you. I haven’t read anybody saying anything like that on this forum. Most people want to comply, moreover, most people want to comply with their employees’ wishes. It’s not anyone’s place to interfere with their personal business. If they do or don’t want to enroll in the program their wishes should be respected. And “guests” of this country are tourists and that label doesn’t apply to most contributors on this forum. FYI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 24 minutes ago, Dostortas said: I haven’t read anybody saying anything like that on this forum. Most people want to comply, moreover, most people want to comply with their employees’ wishes. It’s not anyone’s place to interfere with their personal business. If they do or don’t want to enroll in the program their wishes should be respected. And “guests” of this country are tourists and that label doesn’t apply to most contributors on this forum. FYI. This is again not right and is a very northern mindset. This isn't optional, it's your obligation as an employer to provide these benefits for your domestic workers. They have been excluded from receiving them. There is a HUGE lack of education and information about what they're entitled to on both sides of the fence. Not a single person who is offered a pension, paid sickness and maternity, life insurance, free childcare, paid disability, worker's comp, paid funeral expenses and other social program says no. These are all things that build their future. These are things 75% of workers in this country already have through this system. Without these benefits, there's no retirement, there's no safety net if someone gets hurts, there's no help to take care of kids so people can work, etc. This is a social system - so no, it's not optional. This is the law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 23 minutes ago, Dostortas said: I haven’t read anybody saying anything like that on this forum. Most people want to comply, moreover, most people want to comply with their employees’ wishes. It’s not anyone’s place to interfere with their personal business. If they do or don’t want to enroll in the program their wishes should be respected. And “guests” of this country are tourists and that label doesn’t apply to most contributors on this forum. FYI. And frankly yes, there have been people through this post that aren't not thrilled by this law. Someone said they wouldn't pay it and would their employee go, someone suggested they have their employee sign something saying they didn't want it, someone told someone who said they were interested to relax, that Mexico doesn't enforce laws. Another person gave suggested workarounds. I"m simply here stating the facts of the law and the benefit to these employees. There is absolutely resistance on this board and people seem to care very little about what this could mean for their workers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dostortas Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 I’m quite confident employees will figure out for themselves what’s best for them and their personal situations. No need for “guests” to educate them on social policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 23, 2023 Report Share Posted February 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Dostortas said: I’m quite confident employees will figure out for themselves what’s best for them and their personal situations. No need for “guests” to educate them. Missing the point again. It's the employer's responsibility to do this - it's your obligation and required within the law. Do you understand that? It's kindness to help your employees understand why it's happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferret Posted February 24, 2023 Report Share Posted February 24, 2023 I highly doubt that signing someone up with IMSS for 3 hours work a week is going to get them boodiddleysquat from IMSS. If IMSS did such a great job of taking care of their own people, DIF wouldn't exist nor would the Food Bank or ANY of the charitable donations that exist within Mexico in various States. IMSS has bare bones medical care and can't even provide basic medicines to those in need. WHEN IMSS proves that they can do the job, THEN some of us might be interested in throwing money at them. They'll wait a long time before they get one thin dime from me. In the meantime, I will continue to take care of the people that I may employ and screw the government because they have not proven themselves worthy or capable... law or no law. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Posted February 24, 2023 Report Share Posted February 24, 2023 2 minutes ago, Ferret said: I highly doubt that signing someone up with IMSS for 3 hours work a week is going to get them boodiddleysquat from IMSS. If IMSS did such a great job of taking care of their own people, DIF wouldn't exist nor would the Food Bank or ANY of the charitable donations that exist within Mexico in various States. IMSS has bare bones medical care and can't even provide basic medicines to those in need. WHEN IMSS proves that they can do the job, THEN some of us might be interested in throwing money at them. They'll wait a long time before they get one thin dime from me. In the meantime, I will continue to take care of the people that I may employ and screw the government because they have not proven themselves worthy or capable... law or no law. Wow! So much of your info is incorrect. Why do you live in a country you have such disdain for? Another entitled human with total disregard the culture in which he lives. Such self imposed righteousness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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