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An Ugly American


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I stayed at a nice suites motel in Syracuse some years back... the woman at the desk was the same every time I went, and was a very nice gal. She told me the (very) American band The Turtles had been there just the night before. She said they were the most demanding, rude, messy and awful people she had met in her life. This was long after their hayday; sometime in the 90s. It happens everywhere, doesn't it.

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The Fairmont director in San Francisco was complaining to me one day that they had to buy new pillows and

change carpets in the elevator when the rich guys from the Emiraste would stay, they would get drunk out of their mind, piss in the elevator, use the pillows to eat on them on the floor and made a huge mess of the rooms, meanwhile I used to live in Oxford when Liz Taylor and Richard Burton were filming a movie and it was known in town that one night they had such a fight that the hotel had to replace a lot of furniture and the fireplace...it happens everywhere.

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Unfortunately, there are quite a few "ugly ex-pats" Lakeside. I can only assume "snowbirds".

Yes, I think you are right. For example, on three separate occasions in the last 2 months, I have been in restaurants when a flock of snowbirds landed. The cackling and cawing, quacking and squawking just drowned out the conversation at the rest of the tables. We couldn't hear each other three feet away. We thought that once the flock had settled the volume would go down and it did to an extent. But every time some one of the flock would stretch it's wings and come out with a cock-a-doodle-do, the whole flock would join in with a cacophony of bird calls and we would have to stop talking again. They are certainly a rude presence - but then what could you expect from wild snowbirds?

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Yes, I think you are right. For example, on three separate occasions in the last 2 months, I have been in restaurants when a flock of snowbirds landed. The cackling and cawing, quacking and squawking just drowned out the conversation at the rest of the tables. We couldn't hear each other three feet away. We thought that once the flock had settled the volume would go down and it did to an extent. But every time some one of the flock would stretch it's wings and come out with a cock-a-doodle-do, the whole flock would join in with a cacophony of bird calls and we would have to stop talking again. They are certainly a rude presence - but then what could you expect from wild snowbirds?

Not to mention the driving habits of some of them. I used to complain about bad Mexican drivers. Then the snowbirds arrive.

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there have been many discussions such as this with the usual irellevant back whens,but, this is the first time I've seen dementia and alzheimers mentioned and it is truly relevant. We had a truly bizarre neighbor who disturbed the neighborhood at all hours. The police wouldn't do anything because she was "crazy". To whom would people turn? This is going to become a bigger and bigger issue as our concentrated population ages.

For those simply exercising their right to be abusive, we need to call the police, even if the mexicans won't. Sometimes they are too nice for their own good.

I'll bring this issue to the medical committee of the municipality - how to deal with elders with mental health issues in the general public - too often families won't act.

I'll also bring the issue to the police committee on developing procedure

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Interesting. On this topic of snowbirds, I've noticed--as Cocinart restaurant gains in popularity--more tables of obnoxiously loud expats. I personally don't drink alcohol, and I'm embarrassed that when I did I was probably way too loud at the dinner table.

As Pogo mentioned in the hilarious comparison to geese, the squawkers don't settle for long before they are raising a ruckus all over again. They get so rowdy that we can hear every syllable, for which they should be embarrassed. And the general volume of the whole restaurant goes up to compensate. I know the owners of this particular place are not going to step in, because after all, business is business. But it is annoying as hell. Kinda like when 8 teenagers walk into a local movie theatre show and yack through the whole thing (which never happens in theatres in Guadalajara, by the way). One of the reasons I stopped going to Tango was the incredible noise level.

The Mexicans eating there must be amazed by us, even for a culture that accepts a much noisier environment that we do.

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Interesting. On this topic of snowbirds, I've noticed--as Cocinart restaurant gains in popularity--more tables of obnoxiously loud expats. I personally don't drink alcohol, and I'm embarrassed that when I did I was probably way too loud at the dinner table.

As Pogo mentioned in the hilarious comparison to geese, the squawkers don't settle for long before they are raising a ruckus all over again. They get so rowdy that we can hear every syllable, for which they should be embarrassed. And the general volume of the whole restaurant goes up to compensate. I know the owners of this particular place are not going to step in, because after all, business is business. But it is annoying as hell. Kinda like when 8 teenagers walk into a local movie theatre show and yack through the whole thing (which never happens in theatres in Guadalajara, by the way). One of the reasons I stopped going to Tango was the incredible noise level.

The Mexicans eating there must be amazed by us, even for a culture that accepts a much noisier environment that we do.

I suppose a lot of their obnoxious behavior is because they are on a holiday unlike a lot of us that live here full time.

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In the past, when the obnoxious moved here , it was a small enough community that they were quickly identified and excluded from most activities. In result, they soon left citing the area as cold and unfriendly. There are notable exceptions who probably can't afford to leave..

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The Mexicans eating there must be amazed by us, even for a culture that accepts a much noisier environment that we do.

CG,I'm not sure amazed is the right term,but my wife sure does get a chuckle when I mention some of the posts on these forums. :)

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more tables of obnoxiously loud expats.

They get so rowdy that we can hear every syllable, for which they should be embarrassed.

In the past, when the obnoxious moved here , it was a small enough community that they were quickly identified and excluded from most activities. In result, they soon left citing the area as cold and unfriendly. There are notable exceptions who probably can't afford to leave..

I am someone who is contemplating living in your area. Part of my concern about the community - and this is a concern about any expat heavy location, not just AJ/CH ... is how cliquey is it? I don't want to plunk myself in a community in which people revert to behaving as if they were back in high school. People being shunned and excluded for being a little too loud in a restaurant for the tastes of some folks - sounds potentially like a bad sign. I actually kinda like that there might be a place or three to go and be a little loud now and then.

ps. I do know what genuinely loud and inconsiderate to the point of being obnoxious is. At least I think I do.

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so do we- why would you think otherwise? For sure our panties aren't as twisted as the general expat population worldwide! We were originally an artist and writer colony. That's why we are here . But, bad manners are bad manners worldwide!

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Urbanman, I would take most comments here with a grain of salt. They are not representative of the community on the whole. And as a specific example, in the case of my restaurant post, it is not meant to suggest this is a permanent situation, nor is it widespread. These are just stories of blunders and observations made over time. Further, we have a small group of people on this board who comment regularly, because like me, they seemingly have nothing else to keep them entertained. Although most people who know me personally know I am not a grump, I can appear that way if you just look at some of my comments here.

This is a great and warm area, and the number of people who live here and never read or care about this board far outweighs the number who do. And like you, we all want variety in our lives. On the other hand, I wasn't "shunning" anyone for their actions. That's a tad strong. I was reflecting on an uncommon trend that in particular annoys the heck out of me.

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The thing to remember is the posters on the local web boards represent a small percentage of the expat community. Regular, vocal posters are a smaller percentage of the small percentage. You can not base your judgement of an entire population on what is posted here.

The vast majority of people I encounter in daily life never even read the boards, much less comment on them.

There are cliques here. If you want to be part of an exclusive group of like-minded people you can find them -- no matter what your exclusionary criteria may be. However, most people are free range. They develop over time a small group of close friends based on similar interests, values, and personality traits. They roam at times through the larger community with more acquaintances or remain within their group.

The point is that whatever your idea is of community life you can find it here.

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most people are free range. They develop over time a small group of close friends based on similar interests, values, and personality traits. They roam at times through the larger community with more acquaintances or remain within their group.

The point is that whatever your idea is of community life you can find it here.

Cool phrasing.

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In the past, when the obnoxious moved here , it was a small enough community that they were quickly identified and excluded from most activities. In result, they soon left citing the area as cold and unfriendly. There are notable exceptions who probably can't afford to leave..

I am someone who is contemplating living in your area. Part of my concern about the community - and this is a concern about any expat heavy location, not just AJ/CH ... is how cliquey is it? I don't want to plunk myself in a community in which people revert to behaving as if they were back in high school. People being shunned and excluded for being a little too loud in a restaurant for the tastes of some folks - sounds potentially like a bad sign. I actually kinda like that there might be a place or three to go and be a little loud now and then.

ps. I do know what genuinely loud and inconsiderate to the point of being obnoxious is. At least I think I do.

Then again, some of us tend to avoid Harry. Don't worry about it UrbanMan. It's a pretty diverse community...with plenty of opportunities to get loud.

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If you can't find friends here that you actually like maybe a look in the mirror is due. Lots of very different folks here. Big problem is too many friends especially during winter. Summer is much quieter and a nice change of pace from winter. Pretty smart group of folks here.

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