What exchange rates are people getting from various ATM machines down here?

[Mostlylost]

12 hours ago, Natasha said:

The exchange rate I get on DEBIT card is determined by my home (Canadian) bank  on arrival at their end. Never tied with Visa credit card so can't say.

Are you saying that your debit card does not have a Visa or Mastercard symbol on it?  

[Mostlylost]

10 hours ago, ibarra said:

Foreign exchange fee is determined by your bank. 

All debit cards are managed by either Mastercard or Visa. The symbol is in the corner.  Do you think every bank in the world has someone who daily updates all the international rates? a one branch bank in a small town with 10 employees does that?  

The only thing your bank does is set if there is an foreign exchange fee which can be 0% to 3% or more. Some banks also have a second fee attached when using an ATM that is not theirs. 

https://www.mastercard.com/global/en/personal/get-support/convert-currency.html

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html

 

[Mostlylost]

12 hours ago, Hud said:

Not if it is a Visa or MC atm card ! We are never talking credit cards here, as that is a different animal. I have never had a Debit Card, only an atm card, as I believe the former is too  dangerous to use. If you lose an atm card, no problem, but if you lose a debit or are robbed, problems.  YMMD

An ATM card differs from a debit card how?  Does it not take money directly from your account? 

[Natasha]

2 hours ago, Mostlylost said:

.....daily updates all the international rates? a one branch bank in a small town with 10 employees does that? 

Canadian banks are few, nation-wide, heavily regulated, and huge.  No such thing as a one-town one-branch  banks OR a private-owner public banks. One reason they're considered among the safest in the entire world.👍

I know from moving   $$$ in-house on line (USD-CAD or reverse, in our own accounts) that when I do the process  I am given 2 minutes to reject or accept the exchange rate because that's how fast it fluctuates within our bank.  If I don't like it, I try later. 

With oanda.com you can check (constantly fluctuating) spot rate between any currency, "USUAL" debit card ATM rate ( +/- 2%), or credit card rate (+/- 3 - 3.5%) plus another at4% but I forget what it is.

Since I've only ever used DEBIT card if withdrawing from ATM's here, what I meant to say is I've never tried it with a CREDIT card...... instant withdrawal is fine with me. Is there a different Canadian side exchange rate between the two in this case. Don't know.  Don't care.

[Mostlylost]

3 hours ago, Natasha said:

Canadian banks are few, nation-wide, heavily regulated, and huge.  No such thing as a one-town one-branch  banks OR a private-owner public banks. One reason they're considered among the safest in the entire world.👍

I know from moving   $$$ in-house on line (USD-CAD or reverse, in our own accounts) that when I do the process  I am given 2 minutes to reject or accept the exchange rate because that's how fast it fluctuates within our bank.  If I don't like it, I try later. 

With oanda.com you can check (constantly fluctuating) spot rate between any currency, "USUAL" debit card ATM rate ( +/- 2%), or credit card rate (+/- 3 - 3.5%) plus another at4% but I forget what it is.

Since I've only ever used DEBIT card if withdrawing from ATM's here, what I meant to say is I've never tried it with a CREDIT card...... instant withdrawal is fine with me. Is there a different Canadian side exchange rate between the two in this case. Don't know.  Don't care.

Talking about interbank money exchanges is very different than a Visa or Mastercard debit card. Do not confuse the two.  Apples to oranges. 

Visa and Mastercard set the international exchange rates for their cards regardless of the financial institution's rates. A bank can also have a fee of 0% to 3% or more for foreign exchange, and some banks also add an ATM fee....Those fees are in addition to the rate that is set by Mastercard and Visa.  

Now perhaps your bank does not use Visa or Mastercard and has invested hundreds of millions of dollars to have their own system and their debit and credit cards are not Visa or Mastercard. (Unlike say JP Morgan Chase that has close to 150 million cardholders that let Visa and Mastercard do it for them)

If that is the case then they have a department to set the rates daily on those cards for a hundred or more countries in the event one of your bank's clients is using an ATM converting to let's say..... Bhutanese Ngultrum or the Falkland Island Pound, it would instantly be available for the ATM to process.....just like Mastercard & Visa. 

You can verify the debit card rates 24 hours a day instantly. If you are using a credit card the the exchange rate will be that of the day the merchant process the transaction which may not be the same day as your purchase.

https://www.mastercard.com/global/en/personal/get-support/convert-currency.html

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html

[Natasha]

NOT talking about "inter-bank" exchanges   meant transfer between USD and CAD accounts all in our names, all in SAME bank       and NOT talking about purchases which I know full well can take longer to apply         however, this is getting us all nowhere fast, so let's leave it to the rest

[Mostlylost]

22 minutes ago, Natasha said:

NOT talking about "inter-bank" exchanges   meant transfer between USD and CAD accounts all in our names, all in SAME bank       and NOT talking about purchases which I know full well can take longer to apply         however, this is getting us all nowhere fast, so let's leave it to the rest

Sorry  the subject was ATM rates and I was staying on that theme. You brought up interbank transfers which are managed by another organization, usually The Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunications (SWIFT) system which powers most international money and security transfers.

By your reply your debit card is either a Mastercard or Visa who set the rates for ATM exchanges

All of my statements regarding ATM exchanges are accurate.  My son works for Cirrus (owned by Mastercard) which connects all Mastercard credit, debit and prepaid cards, as well as ATM cards issued by various banks worldwide bearing the Mastercard / Maestro logo. 

Visa has it's own system.

 

[HookEmHorns]

8 hours ago, Mostlylost said:

An ATM card differs from a debit card how?  Does it not take money directly from your account? 

I believe that a debit card can be used to make purchases at stores and online, but an atm card cannot. At least mine can not be used for store purchases. That is why I have only atm cards, not any debit cards. I think that was what she stated.

[HookEmHorns]

1 hour ago, Natasha said:

NOT talking about "inter-bank" exchanges   meant transfer between USD and CAD accounts all in our names, all in SAME bank       and NOT talking about purchases which I know full well can take longer to apply         however, this is getting us all nowhere fast, so let's leave it to the rest

Here we have been talking only about withdrawing funds at a local atm using only a VISA or a MC atm card to do that . If you get pesos without using either of those two cards, then you are not helping this discussion one bit, but actually hindering it. So wht you have been saying does no apply at all here.

[John Shrall]

In the early days of ATM processing, banks (commercial banks S&L, Credit Union and Savings Banks) each had their own network of ATMs for sole use by their customers. 

That was pretty restrictive so up pops regional networks that a group of banks could join. As a bank customer you could use any ATM in that network. 

As networks grew that too became a impediment for people traveling outside their network. 

In 1982 Plus and Cirrus were formed to connect regional networks as well as being the jump off point for international activity. 

In 1987 Master Card bought Cirrus and Visa acquired Plus. Look at the back of your debit card or possibly ATM card to see which network logos appear. 

For a sense of regional networks still alive in the US. check out this list. https://www.atmscrip.com/processing_networks.html

[Mostlylost]

2 hours ago, HookEmHorns said:

I believe that a debit card can be used to make purchases at stores and online, but an atm card cannot. At least mine can not be used for store purchases. That is why I have only atm cards, not any debit cards. I think that was what she stated.

so basically if you use your debit card at only ATM's (as recommended by all financial experts) the safety would be exactly the same. 

Then all you have do do is be aware of ATM's that have been compromised by skimmers  and internal readers that send your information to a nearby bluetooth device. Those ATM's are usually high tourist areas like last year in Cancun with the Russian  group.

[HookEmHorns]

1 hour ago, Mostlylost said:

so basically if you use your debit card at only ATM's (as recommended by all financial experts) the safety would be exactly the same. 

Then all you have do do is be aware of ATM's that have been compromised by skimmers  and internal readers that send your information to a nearby bluetooth device. Those ATM's are usually high tourist areas like last year in Cancun with the Russian  group.

Probably not as safe as an atm card. If you lost it on the way there or back to hiding it, or you were robbed on the street, your debit card could deplete you account of money quickly, but not your atm card. Many debit cards do not require a pin to use outside an atm.  I think NEVER use your atm card anywhere except a secure bank. I will not have a debit card, ever. Too dangerous, IMHO.

 

 

[Ferret]

Interesting. In Canada, both ATM/debit cards and credit cards ALL require PIN numbers. I have never heard of a card not requiring them so I now understand your extreme paranoia.

[HoneyBee]

I have a PIN for my BBVA debit card. In addition, if I want to purchase something on line I need to generate an electronic number with the BBVA apps which is only valid for 5 minutes.

[RickS]

I've never had a debit card... and I've had a bunch.... that did NOT require a PIN.  Now at some Point-of-sale POS (store/gas station) locations one can opt to use it with a PIN or a signature (if it asks... Debit or Credit?).  Also if/when hacked.... and I've had a couple of those, probably at a gas station skimmer!)... my bank/credit union reimburses the hacked funds pretty quickly.... kill the old card number and then send me another Debit card. I've even had their 'fraud department' call me even before I know I've been hacked and ask if it is I making those purchases!

 In this sense I don't see any difference, risk wise, between a Debit card and a Credit card.  I think that in the 'early days' of Debit cards this protection was not there, but....

 

[Mostlylost]

2 hours ago, RickS said:

I've never had a debit card... and I've had a bunch.... that did NOT require a PIN.  Now at some Point-of-sale POS (store/gas station) locations one can opt to use it with a PIN or a signature (if it asks... Debit or Credit?).  Also if/when hacked.... and I've had a couple of those, probably at a gas station skimmer!)... my bank/credit union reimburses the hacked funds pretty quickly.... kill the old card number and then send me another Debit card. I've even had their 'fraud department' call me even before I know I've been hacked and ask if it is I making those purchases!

 In this sense I don't see any difference, risk wise, between a Debit card and a Credit card.  I think that in the 'early days' of Debit cards this protection was not there, but....

 

Actually as of this year financial experts are still advising against using a debit card for point of sale purchases. 

If a credit card is stolen or "hacked" you are not out any money from your account. The credit card company freezes the purchase and the payment to the vender, and there is no interest charged. They then investigate the problem and at some point decide to kill the charge or allow the charge. 

With a debit card is stolen or "hacked" the money is gone from your account instantly.  Smart thieves have been known to drain thousands from the account in a few minutes. The card company will investigate and make a decision about returning the money to your account. Until that happens you do not have the money.  If you  have an online payment pending from the "hacked" account and there are not sufficient funds in your account to cover it it could bounce causing you more problems.

[HookEmHorns]

4 hours ago, Mostlylost said:

Actually as of this year financial experts are still advising against using a debit card for point of sale purchases. 

If a credit card is stolen or "hacked" you are not out any money from your account. The credit card company freezes the purchase and the payment to the vender, and there is no interest charged. They then investigate the problem and at some point decide to kill the charge or allow the charge. 

With a debit card is stolen or "hacked" the money is gone from your account instantly.  Smart thieves have been known to drain thousands from the account in a few minutes. The card company will investigate and make a decision about returning the money to your account. Until that happens you do not have the money.  If you  have an online payment pending from the "hacked" account and there are not sufficient funds in your account to cover it it could bounce causing you more problems.

I was told by a banker that the only safe way to use a debit card was to have a separate account at your bank that you transfer to from your main account daily but ONLY enough funds to cover what you plan to spend that day. Thus, if robbed or lost, that amount of money would be all you will lose. Too much trouble for me, just use a rewards CC, then you also get cash back, etc. No cash back with debit cards.

[HookEmHorns]

7 hours ago, RickS said:

I've never had a debit card... and I've had a bunch.... that did NOT require a PIN.  Now at some Point-of-sale POS (store/gas station) locations one can opt to use it with a PIN or a signature (if it asks... Debit or Credit?).  Also if/when hacked.... and I've had a couple of those, probably at a gas station skimmer!)... my bank/credit union reimburses the hacked funds pretty quickly.... kill the old card number and then send me another Debit card. I've even had their 'fraud department' call me even before I know I've been hacked and ask if it is I making those purchases!

 In this sense I don't see any difference, risk wise, between a Debit card and a Credit card.  I think that in the 'early days' of Debit cards this protection was not there, but....

 

Actually, debit cards do not give you cash back on purchases, mileage, hotels, etc. My understanding from banker is that CCs have much more federal protections than debit cards (CC max loss is only $50, while debit card loss could be Much more) and can offer extended warranties, car insurance,return protections, etc.) I could never find a valid reason to have a debit card.

[Jubilacion]

Now, to continue riding this horse.... 🏇 I just went onto the Visa Debit Card Agreement (USA) and here's exactly what it says, and after reading it I'm once again thinking that the OP may have a point and the question about which local banks offer the best conversion may have some validity or am I missing something below? (As many have said how you calculate your conversion rate is not being done the same for everyone, though it should be).

Page 4 of the VISA DEBIT AGREEMENT. 

5.)  ATM's OUTSIDE OF THE UNITED STATES

"If you use your Card to withdraw foreign currency
from an ATM, or to pay for a purchase with foreign
currency, we charge your account for the U.S. dollar
equivalent of the transaction. Depending on the spe-
cific arrangements that are in place, the exchange
rate and calculation of the U.S. dollar equivalent will
be done by the bank at which you conduct the trans-
action, the network to which the ATM belongs, or
Visa®. The bank or network may also charge a fee.
The currency conversion rate used on the processing
date may differ from the rate in effect on the pur-
chase date or statement posting date. If the exchange
is done by Visa®, the exchange rate between the
transaction currency and the billing currency used for
processing international transactions is as follows:
a rate selected by Visa®from the range of rates
available in wholesale currency markets for the appli-
cable central processing date, which rate may vary
from the rate Visa® itself receives, or the government-
mandated rate in effect for the applicable central
processing date, in each instance, plus or minus any
adjustment determined by us

[Hud]

1 hour ago, Jubilacion said:

Now, to continue riding this horse.... 🏇 I just went onto the Visa Debit Card Agreement (USA) and here's exactly what it says, and after reading it I'm once again thinking that the OP may have a point and the question about which local banks offer the best conversion may have some validity or am I missing something below? (As many have said how you calculate your conversion rate is not being done the same for everyone, though it should be).

Page 4 of the VISA DEBIT AGREEMENT. 

5.)  ATM's OUTSIDE OF THE UNITED STATES

"If you use your Card to withdraw foreign currency
from an ATM, or to pay for a purchase with foreign
currency, we charge your account for the U.S. dollar
equivalent of the transaction. Depending on the spe-
cific arrangements that are in place, the exchange
rate and calculation of the U.S. dollar equivalent will
be done by the bank at which you conduct the trans-
action, the network to which the ATM belongs, or
Visa®. The bank or network may also charge a fee.
The currency conversion rate used on the processing
date may differ from the rate in effect on the pur-
chase date or statement posting date. If the exchange
is done by Visa®, the exchange rate between the
transaction currency and the billing currency used for
processing international transactions is as follows:
a rate selected by Visa®from the range of rates
available in wholesale currency markets for the appli-
cable central processing date, which rate may vary
from the rate Visa® itself receives, or the government-
mandated rate in effect for the applicable central
processing date, in each instance, plus or minus any
adjustment determined by us

 All banks do not change their rate from the previous day to the current day at the same time. Some take longer to do that. That is why if you go early, there is a chance you get the rate from the previous day. From experience, noon and later seems to be the best time for us.

[RickS]

In other words it's a crap shoot....

[Mostlylost]

8 hours ago, RickS said:

In other words it's a crap shoot....

No crap shoot. Just check before you go at either of the 2 options and you will know your rate

https://www.mastercard.com/global/en/personal/get-support/convert-currency.html

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html

[tomgates]

You know, this is pretty simple, just as John S and MLost have pointed out. If those of you who don't understand this, perhaps you best not travel outside the US or Canada. 

Today's(US) Visa exchange rate with 0% bank fee, is 17.7418

[mexijims1]

I use my Capitol One 360 Debit Card ( by Visa) as my ATM card.    I only use it for ATM withdrawals, although it could be used as any other ordinary debit card.

 

Sorry for making a simple question so taxing for everyone.